Somehow paying for Netflix is fine but god forbid I want to watch a 10 hour loop of the DS9 intro without ads.
I think most people are angry with YouTube premium because it’s a service that doesn’t give you anything. It’s a service where they stop annoying you. But it doesn’t unlock anything new that you didn’t have before, doesn’t give you access to content or data you don’t have access to, it doesn’t improve the service. It just removes the annoyances they put there deliberately. So people are a little angry about it
It’s a protection racket, for your attention and time.
It includes youtube music. And creators you watch get more money than if you watched using the ad supported version.
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You also get to play video with a screen off on mobile
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You also get to download for offline viewing
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You also support the creators of the videos, not just google.
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AND FFS YOU DONT GET ADS.
Using adblock isnt some innate human right. They are well within their rights to block adblock.
You get almost the whole worlds information for free in video form. You can be entertained or use it as a teaching tool. It is the best place at this point for product demos and reviews. It is a crazy wealth of information and infrastructure that everyone takes advantage of and somehow just expect to be free. If Google cancells it because it is not profitable, i would bet the efficiency of the entire human race takes a significant nose dive. It also probably runs one of the highest sets of data storage and encoding on the planet.
Can do all of those things without premium if you have the right apps.
But besides that, absolutely not. I remember when YouTube was free with no ads, I remember when the adverts first started appearing, and that’s when it became obvious that they were trying to annoy you into a pay model. It took a little longer than expected, but sure enough, they ramped up the ads until “YOUTUBE PREMIUM! PAY FOR NO ADVERTS!”
Fuck that, I had no adverts before and they took that away. But the worst part is that they harvest my private data and make money from me already. As far as I’m concerned, that’s my subscription to their shit, in their perverse data selling.
No fucking way I’m going to also pay them for the privilege to have my private data sold.
So… you dont like the service… just dont use it at all anymore. Then they cant track your data as well.
It’s almost like they were bleeding money and needed to at least break even.
You also get videos crammed full with sponsors. One might say that most videos on YouTube are ads themselves. YT Premium does not have Sponsorblock. Alphabet makes money by selling your data and they continue to do so when you pay them. I support a select few creators via Patreon. Fuck Alphabet, they’re not getting a single cent from me.
Oh, ffs. You dont see that the reason you “need” sponsorblock is because we used adblock so much that the only way the creators could make a living was injecting their own adds into their own videos.
The money youtube makes from selling your data does not cover the cost of running the business.
What about all the creators of videos you watched that you dont support on patreon? They dont deserve anything for their work?
Ok a few points.
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Youtube is in their right to show ads and shove them in my face. They can also try to block my adblocker. Their platform their rules.
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Youtubers adding sponsors into their Video is because Youtube does not pay them for the ads that are shown, or at least not fairly. Also because people want to earn money with Youtube which is partially a problem in the first place.
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Yes youtube is expensive to run and they have been in the minus for years, but just as they make profit they go all the way and force you into Premium! They can try that but it’s in my right to use the Service with adblock and sponsorblock until they go to a subscription only Service.
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Using adblock isnt some innate human right. They are well within their rights to block adblock.
Well, they’re free to try
So, some basic features that you can/used to get by just using a web browser, and soemthing that you can do directly via Patreon.
Definitely value for money.
Not all creators have patreon. Also are you using patreon to pay google?
Seems like premium with extra steps?
You’re arguing with one of three things.
A employee of Google, a troll, or a child.
Mostly I just want to believe that, because I want to believe there aren’t people who blindly shill for a company that neither knows nor cares they exist.
Wow look at all the blind shills.
Im neither. Im a software developer for a small tech company.
My reasoning is 100% selfish. I dont want the content creators that i watch to stop creating things i find incredibly valuable. And i dont want google to cancel a service that i find incredibly valuable.
Dont think that they wont do it. It just has to become unprofitable.
They have already killed 14 services this year alone. https://killedbygoogle.com/
People are ridiculous sometimes. These companies aren’t going to eat millions of dollars per day in hosting costs to appease the minority who expect everything to just be given to them.
I have all those things with ReVanced
Revanced pays the content creators and google for your usage?
I kinda want Google to just cancel YouTube. Shit would be hilarious. Also sad and we would lose soooooo much information. But still I kinda just want to see what happens. What new players enter the game, will the monopoly be broken? Though I’m sure Microsoft, Amazon, and other big boys would roll their own versions of YouTube and effectively there would not be a difference, just a small amount of fragmentation.
But still…
According to the Lemmy community the folks over at selfhosting will just spawn an international CDN on their raspberry pis and deliver my 5 hour, 400GiB Starfield all categories speedrun recording for free out of good will. Right?
The fact the guy above you has been downvoted, and you are upvoted makes me think people dont see this comment is clearly sarcastic.
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I thought YouTube music was a separate subscription?
It is not, unless they perhaps have a YT Music-only subscription but I haven’t seen such.Edit: It looks like there is a YT Music Only subscription available, for $3/mo cheaper. I’d still say if you use YouTube any more than just on one-off occasions, its still worth picking up regular YT Premium if you’re grabbing the music one anyways, but at least the option is there.
… I don’t know where I got this idea. And I just got another month of Spotify too. Isn’t there an easy way to transfer your playlists over there?
As far as I’m aware, none of the music services really have a direct transfer option available. You pretty much have to use a third party service to do so from what I found the last time I tried to do a major switch.
Funnily enough, I feel like this is one of those things that are present day “AI” could probably help with, if it were integrated with these services. Realistically you’d just need something to do some OCR of images from your playlists, and match the results - I’m kind of surprised that’s not something Spotify, Google, etc have done yet.
Awesome thanks!
As mentioned, third party services are there
There was a YouTube music only tier I was on when I moved from Google Play Music. Eventually I figured out about YouTube Premimum including the music so I changed to that
Oh, interesting, you’re correct there does appear to be one which looks to be $3 cheaper. I’ll edit my comment to reflect that, thanks!
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_IaVMsCbf8
It’s just a little advertisment
Come to Quarks, Quarks is fun, Don’t walk Run!
Yeah I need youtube premium in order to enable background play on the official app. This is ridiculous, especially on a mobile operating system that made fun of the competition because it didnt have true multitasking. Ever since then it’s kinda been it for me. Like I cant multitask on my computer device because you want me to pay a subscription? No thanks.
It’s a protection racket, for your attention and time.
It is, but it is only between the free and paid versions. I can’t expect a service to exist for my use without some form of compensation. I’d rather pay with money than time.
Thats one way to look at it.
The other way is to compare it to the free netflix tier… which doesnt exist.
IMO even being pestered to death I’m slightly amazed that its still free at all.
The problem with this point of view is that Netflix either produces its own content or rents content from other producers. YouTube doesn’t produce its own content and also doesn’t rent content from producers… it only pays them a percentage of ad revenue (to be comparable to Netflix, YouTube would have to pay creators up front regardless of ad revenue they generate). YouTube profits from the content production of its users, and doesn’t actually pay a fair amount for it. For them to charge for access to that content is just… egregious.
People post their content to YT for 3 primary reasons
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Hosting is free. (In which case they are implicitly giving YT permission to profit off them in return for not charging hosting fees.
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They want the largest possible potential audience. Which YT spent a mind boggling amount of money and effort to build. (Although I do wish they had some form of legitimate competition, cant argue that point)
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They want to make money off the advertising revenue. (Which aside from Floatplane, is next to impossible to do otherwise)
There is nothing stopping content creators from hosting their own videos on their own servers they pay for but they dont. Because how do you generate the traffic? How do you get clickthroughs? How do you generate income, or just cover expenses?
YT dont owe you anything for free. Its not egregious, its business.
You’re not a musician, are you?
Because what you just described is just the classic: “Oh, we’re not going to pay you for this gig. You’re getting paid in exposure. Sorry kid, just business.”
So dont upload your stuff to that platform or make sure you use their platform to make the exposure work for you to generate money. If you can name another service that will put you in front of 122 million daily users and 2.7 BILLION global users I’d love to hear about it.
Justin Bieber was discovered on YT, Linus Sebastian just rejected a $100,000,000 offer for the media company he built largely on Youtubes back and Mighty Car Mods makes an estimated $46k a month. Youtube is not a public service. If you dont like it, dont use it. If you do use it, make it work for you.
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While I use piped myself I am k with their business model, its just degrading every year making the experience worse for everyone. YouTube can’t be compared to Netflix if you look at the bandwidth and the amount of users who don’t pay for it. Hosting such a huge video sharing platform for free will never be profitable and the only other way is to make it paid only like Netflix which is obviously not gonna happen. Yeah they have 0 morals, yeah google sucks ass, yeah they treat their users like pigs but wishing it should be completely free with no ads is just wishful thinking.
I want to bookmark this comment as my thoughts on this are basically the same but I’m sure I’ll forget it the next time I need to put it into words.
Also, I don’t think wanting everything to be paid is a good idea in the world we live in, although I can’t think of a world where there’s only a paid option is a good idea. What I mean is that there was a time when I benefitted from the free access to information that the internet provided, now things have evolved to be a bad version of that with widespread misinformation and really egregious ads; but that old internet with ads only there to recoup the hosting costs and people sharing information for the joy of it will always be something I’ll argue for.
P.S. I am not opposed to a better internet than what we had but for that there are changes needed to the rest of the world that won’t come any time soon, otherwise what we had was the ideal version.
I think there always will be free access to information in some form but video hosting specifically is simply too expensive when it grows to the size of YouTube. If you aren’t paying for something and it isn’t run by donations, you’re likely paying it with your personal info or time. I personally wouldn’t mind paying for a service like YouTube but the content I watch are simply nowhere else to find so piped is the closest thing I have now.
I pay for YouTube, so you won’t find disagreement from me. Optional paid versions are okay to me, though I do wish ads weren’t just so awful (scams, viruses, etc)
it doesn’t improve the service.
Doesn’t it do exactly that? It removes the ads whoch makes it way better.
But it doesn’t unlock anything new that you didn’t have before
It does give you access to higher quality streaming though, offline play, background play, video queue, picture in picture and youtube music premium. Do you even know what you are talking about?
Yes I do, thank you for asking.
You’d have a much stronger point if all the following were free: bandwidth, server farms, developers, support staff.
Since they aren’t, something needs to pay for those. I’m paying to not see that something.
There was some original content, there is offline play, ad removal, however they should allow premium to skip sponsor ads too if you ask me.
I thought it was a decent deal for $15/mo for family of 3 using it for music and yt. $23 is pushing it.
I dont agree on the sponsor adds because that money is money the creator gets directly that isnt totally dependent on the policies that YT pushes. If those spots become worth less to the creators because they are skippable then they are more dependent on YT for their revenue.
While I do get it, they shouldn’t need those sponsors if I’m paying to watch their videos. If YT is injecting ads to pay them.
It’s two sources of ads for the viewer, who can only pay to remove one of them
It’s a shitty model for everyone.
I think the flip side to that is then thats your issue with the creator. Its between you and them wether you’re willing to suffer their product placement.
If you imbed sponsor spots AND I have premium theres no way on gods green earth I’m buying merch or joining your patreon. Not unless your content is accurate predictions of lottery numbers for subscribers.
And on top of that, Youtube’s annoyances are implemented client-side – in other words, by co-opting your own machine, your property that you own, and turning it against you to serve someone else’s interests.
Youtube is free to choose not to serve me content in the first place, but once they do and it’s on my machine, it is my property right to control the computation of my machine however I want. I have just as much right to block ads as I do to write in the margins of a paper book I bought.
Edit: why the downvotes? Do y’all hate property rights or something?
Agreed. If you get the data you should be able to interpret it how you like
I take the same philosophy for radio signals, if the signal’s going through my head physically, I should be able to listen to it
That’s why we should have the right to listen to every phone call happening near us
If the electrons are passing through your head, record that signal! Have fun with it
And here I am, getting the same thing and paying nothing because I’ve got uBlock Origin.
How do you run that on a smart tv?
Seriously, this is why I eventually got it. Plus my android vanced stopped working and I didn’t know there was a way to fix it
ReVanced
I did, but that still only solves mobile and I mostly watch on the TV
For TV SmartTubeNext and you’re all set.
Look up
I don’t. I just plug a pc directly to my tv.
Smart tube, or I’ve been told a pi hole works as well. I haven’t bothered with that though, because I don’t like watching YT on TV myself. Out of the two, the pi hole is probably the better option since it works with all your devices.
Smartnexttube
Smarttube
This works fine but the main reason I personally have premium is to support the YouTubers I watch. Adblock gets rid of their revenue while premium pays them MORE than just ads do and now I don’t have to worry about it on any platform.
Premium still gives them hardly anything. Subscribing to their Patreon is better because they get all your money, minus the small fee.
True but I can afford premium. I can’t afford every single persons patreon.
They’re better off for life if you donate the money you’d spend with yt once for each, once per month. Many will have their turns.
That is a ton of work, especially when not every YTer has Patreon or channel memberships. Afaik, YTers do appreciate Premium views since it pays way more than ads.
It gives them a loot more than ad watchers though. Especially on longer videos (it’s based on watch time)
Since youtube has been starting to wage war against adblock I decided to try out using freetube and have been enjoying it. It does have some limitations but since its not tied to the algorithm it reminds me of how I used to have to browse youtube in the older days. Also I feel like the up-next option is way more valuable than it is with the algorithm. Instead of being based off of what I watch its like the old method so it might recommend more vids from the creator or channels like the creator.
Instead of stuff that Ive already watched or am already subscribed to, or that one weird thing the algorithm is pushing for no reason that I keep ignoring but it keeps shoving at me.
Discovery requires a little more creativity with searching and for some categories this can get broad, but the result is finding more teeny tiny creators as well which is neat.
I was getting blocked for having uBlock Origin, but how I solved that was to purge the filter lists in the settings and re-download them. Now I can watch again.
Oh yeah that does work as well, but I decided to give the open source front end a try as well and enjoyed the experience enough to keep at it.
There’s always one.
YMusic
Yes. I pay for YouTube Music for my six account family and, as a side benefit, we all get ad-free YouTube.
Not YouTube music, YMusic…
I also have No ads, because I use NewPipe. There I can watch all Videos from YouTube, cccBerlin, pearTube and it is also possible to Listen to Music from Bandcamp and Soundcloud.
Honestly not worth the trouble on mobile
Unless you’re on an iPhone, setting up Revanced takes less than 10 minutes and very rarely breaks anything. If you want to support your YouTube creators, then sure pay for premium, but it baffles me how someone could have the technical prowess to set up a Lemmy account, but then balk at something like this. If anything, mobile might be one of the last frontiers now that they’re starting a war against adblock.
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I use adblock on Firefox on my phone. Used to be fun to jailbreak and install my own apps and stuff, just getting lazier as I age I think
Youtube constantly demonitizes content creators, while protecting doxxers and content thieves. I will not be giving them a single red cent.
Don’t give them viewership too.
You’re giving too much credit, Youtube doesn’t care and is running on AI autopilot. This benefits IP abusers, thieves, and trolls and hurts legitimate creators. But it’s not on purpose, it’s just indifference.
This right here. I did youtube premium one time to watch the first season of cobra kai. And then immediately dropped it when that same month 3 content creators I followed all came forward with videos of how they were getting obviously fraudulent copyright strikes, demonetized over things that they didn’t do wrong and youtube just screwing them over cause they could.
A company that makes billions in profits could easily afford to put better content creator support in place and cover costs or disputes against content creators so none of the people who make their site profitable in the first place ever have to worry if they’ll still be paid for the hours and hours they devote to their channel only for a troll or bad faith actor to make a false claim on their videos and irrevocably remove income.
If your reason is only moral, then you should also never use the service.
Moral reasons
🙄
A corporation can blatantly violate the law, bribe politicians, ignore its TOS whenever its suits them, but a second somebody wants to use a heavily subsidised service without being assaulted by advertising, a gaggle of concern trolls pop up to lecture about “stealing service”. Buddy, simping for Alphabet will get you nowhere.
If you are against them on a moral basis then use another service, I imagine that has a more negative impact on them. If you just want no ads, pay for it.
I hate ads as much as the next guy and use a variety of blockers but i’ll pay for any service with a reasonable payment method.
What other service will let me watch YouTube videos?
Specifically youtube-videos? None. For similar videos there are a bunch of services, at least to watch for entertainment purpose.
The price of food items has gone almost 50% up during last year, the wages are not keeping up with inflation, and I already pay for utilities and internet. I ain’t paying shiiiiiiiit.
Okay, so this actually has nothing to do with how YouTube “demonitizes content creators, while protecting doxxers and content thieves”. It’s actually just about you not wanting to pay for it.
Which is fine! But why lie to yourself about it?
Why not both? I can disdain YouTube for shitting on creators while refusing to pay for subpar service.
Wouldn’t it be better then to instead watch those creators on a platform that treats the creators better?
You Dutch? Pretty sure red cent is a Dutch saying.
Somehow paying for Netflix is fine
I was saying paying for Netflix is not fineIs praying for netflix fine?
Only praying for it to die
how do we have every emote and I can never find any of them
Paying for premium is fine, but premium users letting Youtube off the hook for their corporate greed is annoying. If YT ran reasonable ads like they used to in the olden days I wouldn’t use an adblocker. Don’t even get me started on their garbage search, a multi billion dollar company can and should do better. Then of course there’s the fiasco of their demonetization system, and rules that apply to some but not others. Simply put they don’t deserve to be paid for premium, if their grinch heart grows and they decide to do better as a company I’d honestly pay for premium.
Tbh, I almost caved and got premium, but I have a lot of the same issues with Youtube that you have.
A big YouTuber was doxxed recently by another big YouTuber, and Youtube did nothing about it. If I was him, I would be going to court.
YouTube is trash, and if a viable alternative were to exist then I would switch in a heartbeat.
But I’m all about convenience, so until that alternative exists, if I have to give some money to YouTube to have that convenience, I’ll do it.
While the monopoly that YT has as a video platform is definitely an issue, the cost of maintaining the content has definitely risen now. 480p vs 4k videos have a ton of difference in bandwidth, no matter how much Internet speeds have evolved over the years.
I used Google Play Music (RIP) and moved into YT Music for my music streaming needs. The cost of YT premium was marginally higher so I switched for it.
The major issue with YT Premium is that they still collect the data from YT to show targeted ads, but I use also use uBlock, so that doesn’t really bother me as much.
Point is, video hosting services are expensive. The quantity (not quality) of content on YT is way higher than any othet streaming service, and maintaining that for free is pretty close to impossible. The only possible alternative would be a government backed video platform and that’s definitely worse.
Us premium users have no obligation to help non premiums.
At the end of the day Youtube or Google offer no ads experience for us and we get it. Transaction is completed.
“us premium users” “non premiums” holy shit dude, you’re gonna get shafted too, you just pay $14 a month for the privilege of it happening later
Shafted? Got monies , not poor PoS.
LMAO I spend my money on better things like holidays and park visits.
You waste it on a website.
Watch me get the premium experience for free using U-Block origin. Byeee sucker!
Oh I do use Adguard Premium. Sucker.
Somehow paying for Netflix is fine
is it tho? is it?
Only I can have double standards.
Meanwhile I’m over here like:
That scene when he struts up to the guys naked and full of attitude in Chernobyl should have won him an emmy. Love this actor!
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What series is this?
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Not the same guy. That was Alex Ferns. This is Michael Hough.
I’ll pay to not be exposed to ads. I’ll also pay to support a service I get value from. So I’m paying for YouTube premium, Netflix, Hulu. etc. When a service with media I want that has a more desirable corporate structure becomes available I’ll pay for that and maybe get rid of other services. I also occasionally sail the high seas if the thing I want isn’t available on any of the services I’m already paying for.
paying for netflix isn’t fine either
You think that’s bad? Mention you use a HP printer sometime. I dare you to try it.
Trigger warning:
I have an HP inkjet printer attached to my Windows 11 machine playing YouTube Premium in Chrome without an ad blocker.
Edit: it’s a joke, people.
How else are you supposed to print out your favorite videos?
Has HP started blocking ad-blockers? Seriously it wouldn’t surprise me.
Well owning a HP inkjet is an objectively stupid thing to do.
Thanks for proving my point!
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Eh, HP has always worked fine for us. I have two sitting here, actually - one is an all-in-one from ~2009 that we printed our wedding programs on when it was new, and it still works fine, but ink is getting harder to find for it, and we had a scare with the irreplaceable print head a few years ago (I got it working, using HP’s “try this if you’re out of options, but it’s unlikely to work” directions, but we realized it was probably time to consider replacing it).
The other is a few years old and is one of the ones with the subscription service. We’ve had a good experience with it, and I spend less on ink than I did with the old one, but that upsets a LOT of people.
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For what it’s worth, all of HP’s business hardware is very good, whether it’s printers or PC systems. It’s just the cheap consumer-oriented products that suck.
Same thing with Dell
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First, it’s nice to get a reasonable response to my comment. Most of the responses about HP printers are people foaming at the mouth. Even a few here, in a thread meant to be funny, generated some of that.
Yeah, I might go with a laser next time. I’ve read that Brother makes a pretty good laser printer, and I see color models are like $250, which isn’t bad. We’ll see. No major rush right now. I would miss the flatbed scanner; I do use that (maybe as much as the printer) for random things.
Oh…haha…I just went to Brother’s site to look at one, and oh look, there’s a toner subscription service!
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No way, Only Brushes and paint for me. Of course I steal it cause why should I pay for it?
😭
I use an HP inkjet with original cartridges
Using an HP printer is like playing Russian Roulette with a ton of loaded bullets. I say this as someone with multiple HP printers.
I subscribe to YouTube Music and have since the Play days (R.I.P.). Watching videos without ads is just a perk.
This is basically my stance. Its also one of a very few subs I use, I don’t really care to watch streaming services or to pay for the slightly (maybe?) better other music streaming services.
I still have Premium but could never accept YT music as a former Play user. Why did they end the best music streaming service for this unusable trash?
Spotify is still worse than Play was, but at least it’s good at recommending music. YT music is worse in every regard. Except for smart watch integration maybe.
Play was the best, especially in the early days with the professionally curated (by humans) play lists. I discovered so much new music. AI generated playlists are terrible.
Use Newpipe like a true comrade.
YouTube without ads on Android, and you can run it in the background with/without the screen off.
Newpipe gang rise up
Brand new: https://grayjay.app/
Has downloads, dislikes, Youtube, Odysee, Rumble, Twitch, Kick, and more plugins, no ads, can cast to devices, offline subscriptions and was paid for by Louis Rossman. Out for a week now. Loving it so far. Just needs Sponsorblock and it will replace Newpipe+Sponsorblock for me. It’s open source but paid software.
We offer a way to pay for the app once. The app will function identically without paying.
You can even use it if you’re NOT filthy commie scum!
I just find the cost of Premium to be too high.
Here in Sweden it costs about 120SEK/month, that is far too much, I’d happily pay 60-70SEK/month, that would be worth it to me.
And would still give rhem more money than me not watching ads
They really do fuck us in the Nordics. It’s DKK179 (SEK281, USD26) for the family plan here in Denmark. Granted that’s the whole family getting YouTube Premium and Music, but that’s also I think the highest price anywhere in the world.
Only service where I’ve done the region thing. Paying 15 kr a month because I signed up through Argentina.
The price is insane just for getting rid of ads. Amazon Prime is cheaper than that and gives you a ton of benefits.
Eh, I watch a lot of youtube to and from the office, for me 60SEK/month would be worth it
Yeah, I’d also be fine paying half the price they charge right now
Is that much more than Spotify in Sweden?
No idea, I have never used Spotify
Hear me out: ublock origin on your computer and revanced manager on your phone.
And for my old smart TV? Or when I’m at work?
I use iPhone. And I like downloading videos way way way too much. UBlock origin is goated tho.
And I don’t want ads when I cast to my tv.
https://github.com/qnblackcat/uYouPlus/wiki/Installation
You can sideload an adblocking YouTube app on iOS
Or use a PiHole for your entire network.
That is very useful information. Thanks!
What are the risks of installing a third party App Store like this. I notice it was called TrollStore.
Relatively low risk, these are open-source projects with fairly significant userbases of technical users who can and do call out troubling code if it’s present.
While you are doing so at your own risk, sideloading isn’t inherently risky. It’s far safer than jailbreaking, for sure. The risk is not really with the store, but with the apps you download from it. I recommend only downloading more popular and trusted apps with public code and some community oversight.
Almost none. Just be careful who you give your data to.
PiHole can block YouTube ads? Specifically on iOS?? Didn’t think DNS blocking could accomplish this and an app like Magic Lasso was required?
I use NextDNS and it cannot block iOS YouTube ads.
Honestly not entirely sure about iOS. I use a PiHole and several other adblocking solutions, but don’t personally use any apple devices. Family members with iOS devices have repeatedly commented that they are confused and delighted that they never see ads at my house, though.
I pay for it so my kids’ accounts don’t have ads. They’re too young to sort out all the edge cases that aggressive ad blocking generates and for a bonus we get youtube music.
